DO NOT JOIN Maker Studios (RPM Networks, ParaMaker, TGS) READ THIS TO KNOW WHY!

[Tarmack]

I am glad that you understand that the serious issue that I wanted to inform everyone was about the fraud, not the "support". The support is something I could deal with, but fraud is definitely something I can't accept, and you seem to understand this point and know the implications.

I dealt with a similar issue of contractual termination. I was partnered with a BBTV sub-network whose main hub channel (where my content was being posted) was partnered by Fullscreen. So I'm very familiar with breach of contract. Luckily, I was able to get out.

Ultimately the support issue happens with every network. They all say "we'll help promote you" but it's always limited and mostly up to the channel owner. Honestly, it's best this way. Networks wouldn't be able to function if they had to actively promote every partner channel. Or more correctly, none of us would be partnered, only the big ones worthy of promotion would be.

You could try Reddit bombing them. It might backfire because Reddit is fickle that way, but it could help get the job done if you treat it as an "ask for help" kind of post.

 

[TheBatteryChicken]

There's currently fairly big youtubers who have openly stated on twitter that they don't want to be partnered with maker and telling everyone not to partner with them. The reasons being that maker haven't done anything to help them at all and just take their cut at the end of every month

 

[hahahahahaCRAZYhahahahaha]

Sure... but at this point this information is redundant to me, as I've suffered first hand in terms of lack of support. But fraud-wise I never saw anybody talking about it, not before I joined anyway, because the exchange feature was released in March 2013, when I was already in the network since 2012. The RWJ case did not involve fraud and it was the only thing I'd heard that sounded serious and I think that also happened after I was already with Maker. Everything else I read about was small stuff that I could live with, things that affect every network, so something that I couldn't escape from if I wanted to get into a MCN. But I can't live with fraud, and everyone should know that Maker is doing it. Had I been informed, I wouldn't have joined because I would never intentionally put my AdSense account in jeopardy, I mean, who would do that? People fall for it because Maker is not disclosing things, in other words they are committing a crime.

There's currently fairly big youtubers who have openly stated on twitter that they don't want to be partnered with maker and telling everyone not to partner with them. The reasons being that maker haven't done anything to help them at all and just take their cut at the end of every month

 

[TheBatteryChicken]

Sure... but at this point this information is redundant to me, as I've suffered first hand in terms of lack of support. But fraud-wise I never saw anybody talking about it, not before I joined anyway, because the dashboard was released in March 2013, when I was already in the network since 2012. The RWJ case did not involve fraud and it was the only thing I'd heard that sounded serious and I think that also happened before I was already with Maker. Everything else I read about was small stuff that I could live with, things that affect every network, so something that I couldn't escape from if I wanted to get into a MCN. But I can't live with fraud, and everyone should know that Maker is doing it. Had I been informed, I wouldn't have joined because I would never intentionally put my AdSense account in jeopardy, I mean, who would do that? People fall for it because Maker is not disclosing things, in other words they are committing a crime.

I've always known about maker doing shady s**t but they also aren't the only ones, there's 2 networks I would apply to and both require over 20k subs and both are local enough so if they try and f**k me over I can run up in their office with a few dozen people and set it straight

 

[hahahahahaCRAZYhahahahaha]

Yes, and I recognize that. That's why I said "don't join particularly if you are not in the USA", because it will be impossible to go there personally if you're not making a lot of money. You're pretty lucky that you can deal with it personally, I wish I could go there and stir up a shitstorm, but they would probably call the police and say that I was physically threatening them or some other kind of lie...

I've always known about maker doing shady s**t but they also aren't the only ones, there's 2 networks I would apply to and both require over 20k subs and both are local enough so if they try and f**k me over I can run up in their office with a few dozen people and set it straight

 

[Michael]

It is their issue though not your own if they are breaking YouTubes TOS by offering such a service, in what way is the service breaching the contract you have with them?

Does the service involve viewing their videos too or is it just likes, commenting etc?

 

[hahahahahaCRAZYhahahahaha]

If your account is under their CMS, you can be equally liable, because in effect it becomes "theirs". Also, there is no merit in arguing that only Maker is breaking the ToS since they shouldn't be breaking anything! They should be acting responsibly. Who would want to be linked with a business that breaks rules? I certainly don't. If they informed me that they were going to break terms and conditions, I would never have passed control of my account to them. NEVER. The feature included views, subscriptions, likes, favourites and comments.

It is their issue though not your own if they are breaking YouTubes TOS by offering such a service, in what way is the service breaching the contract you have with them?

Does the service involve viewing their videos too or is it just likes, commenting etc?

[DOUBLEPOST=1372976917,1372976031][/DOUBLEPOST]FYI I'm going to sleep now, so won't be replying to this thread until I log on again.

 

[Invisible]

I do not try to protect Maker, but you can find a shady parts on every Network i think if you look for it carefully.
Maybe you just realised that you have bad split and decided to find the shady parts in the Network actions and trying to point to it as a way to release you early for breaching contract, so you can sign with better split elsewhere?

Regarding your mentioned issues:
1. if its optional feature to like in exchange to points, then i do not see the problem, you can just do not use it to be on a safe side.
2. regarding keeping your channel forever as you mentioned: if you have a release date how you can say that they can keep your channel forever?

 

[unknown_user00005]

Interesting that you mention that.
If this network you had issues with that I may or may not have mentioned is the same network that RWJ may or may not have been in pretty much does this to the big as well as small guys. Seems like it's this network's standard business to try to shut people up and try to cover up their mess.

This "may" just be the best post on YTtalk..

 

[hahahahahaCRAZYhahahahaha]

First of all, I do not want to sign with anybody. If you think that after finding this out I will sign up with any other network, you're kidding yourself, with all due respect. Like you said, "you can find a shady part on every network", therefore it would be stupid of me to sign up with another one. If I'm not signing up with anybody, splits have nothing to do with it.

You, "nicekid76" and some other people do not seem to understand what fraud means, I suggest you guys use some of your adsense to go buy a dictionary, or let me paste the definition here for you guys from the Oxford Dictionary of British English:

fraud |frɔːd|
noun [ mass noun ]
wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain: he was convicted of fraud | [ count noun ] : prosecutions for social security frauds.

• [ count noun ] a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities: mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds.

I can only feel pity for the people who think that what Maker do is acceptable, like "nicekid76". If you think that committing a crime is acceptable, then you are just as corrupt as the network and I don't really care about your opinions because corrupt people are bad people. If you accept to let a criminal take care of your money, then you are simply... stupid. You can get offended as much as you want with that but if you knowingly let a criminal handle your money, what else can you be called? And if you expect someone else to let it happen, then you're arrogant as well. If you're reading the terms of service to keep yourself up to date (I read it once every year to make sure that I'm doing everything right) and find out that the network has been doing wrongful stuff that violates the terms of service and you don't ask to get out immediately, you deserve to be taken advantage of and I sincerely hope that you do. I asked to get out because I don't want criminals taking care of my cash/account. I don't care if every network does this. Many wrongs do not make one right.

Now to answer your second question, the release date is as pointless as the contract. They can keep anybody's channel forever if they want, because they are under no obligation to follow the contract. If they think that you don't have the means to hire a lawyer to fight them, there is nothing to stop them from keeping your channel locked in to their CMS forever. Once you click on the button to give them your account, they can keep it for as long as they want it, it doesn't matter what the contract states because this is the theory, the system allows them to keep the account for themselves. YouTube does not care about contracts between users and networks, they WON'T release your channel from anybody's CMS even if you clearly show them that the contract was over. It is the network who has to release you manually from the CMS. YouTube will NEVER touch anybody's CMS, regardless of contracts between users and networks, so by knowing this, they can take control of your account forever and there is NOTHING you can do about that.

Just to show you the reply from a YouTube employer when I posted on YouTube's own partner forum explaining the situation and asking them to give my account back to me:

"Youtube will not intervene in network disputes; this is between you and the network you are signed to.

If you believe the network has violated the terms of the contract, or that the contract should now be voided, you should consult a legal attorney."
As you can see, the very first sentence shows that networks have all the control, and you have none. That is, if you sign up with a network. If you don't, the account is 100% in your control, which is what I want. I don't want to leave my money in criminal's hands.

I do not try to protect Maker, but you can find a shady parts on every Network i think if you look for it carefully.
Maybe you just realised that you have bad split and decided to find the shady parts in the Network actions and trying to point to it as a way to release you early for breaching contract, so you can sign with better split elsewhere?

Regarding your mentioned issues:
1. if its optional feature to like in exchange to points, then i do not see the problem, you can just do not use it to be on a safe side.
2. regarding keeping your channel forever as you mentioned: if you have a release date how you can say that they can keep your channel forever?