I have 2.8m subscribers and need some help

[wolfpackfilms]

Hi everyone,

My channel PDK Films has 2.8m subs and is pulling in an avg of 40-50m views a month and 200k subs a month. I'm considering joining an MCN but I am very hesitant. I get a ton of emails from MCNs everyday and I always delete them. I was in an MCN for two months back in 2014, and they took 20% of my revenue without giving me a thing in return, which is why I am very hesitant to join one again.

That being said, Studio71 has my attention right now and I spoke with their head of partner relations for 2 hours on the phone last week about their services and how they can help grow and monetize my channel etc. He offered me a 90/10 split for my channel. I was told that in my top earning countries he thinks my CPMs will increase by $1 to $1.50 which should "help make a dent in their cut" (referring to the 90/10 split). Additionally, I'd have access to all the typical things you'd expect a large channel to be offered.

Now, the reason I'm even considering joining Studio71 is because I'm interested in getting help with:

- Growing my channel
- Acquiring brand sponsorships
- Creating and selling products (stuff more specialized than your typical apparel
- Dedicated sales and higher CPMs etc. (MY CPM ON PDK FILMS IS $3.17 for the last 28 days, which I consider low, anyone else have thoughts on this??)

I'm just not really sure if I'll end up making more with them with a 90/10 split. I have no idea what it's like being a large channel partnered to an MCN. I emailed the guy back (keep in mind he the HEAD of partner relations, not just an avg joe) and said that 90/10 is too low and I'd be more inclined with a 95/5. It's been a week and he has followed up twice (I haven't responded) stating that they would be losing money on a 90/10 and that is the best they can offer.

I'm now reading about BBTV offering some channels 100/0 contracts and other MCNs offering 95/5 and up. I know Studio71 really wants me because he keeps following up, but I'm not sure if 90/10 is a good deal or if I should ask for more or just remain independent or look into different networks.

So there, I gave you info about my channel, my goals in an MCN partnership, and the offer on the table. I'd really appreciate any and all advice and input from you guys on what you think I should do, because to be honest, I have not a clue.

Best
Paul

 

[Scapestrato]

Did they also offer a signing up bonus?

 

[wolfpackfilms]

Did they also offer a signing up bonus?

They offered a 4k signing bonus for 1 year and 9k signing bonus for two. I responded back last night and said that I don't see the value in a 90/10 agreement and he responded and said he was sorry and thats the best they can do, so I guess I know now that that is the best they can offer, but I have to decide if its worth it to me. What do you guys think? anyone have any experience with them? do we have any recommendations for different networks?

LET ME KNOWWWW

 

[Sibernethy]

As a former head of partner relations in an MCN myself, I have a few comments to make:

1: 90/10 sounds extremely fair, considering what it takes to run an MCN. Don't be the type that won't settle for 99/1 because without some kind of revenue, the MCN will be unable to properly serve your channel because they're not able to gather the funds and resources they need to get the job done. By now, I'd imagine you probably earn more than the company itself does, though that's just a guess.

2: How well do the staff treat you? How well do you treat the staff? They both tend to go together, really. Back when I was head of partner relations in an MCN, I was pretty much the only guy tending to the needs and concerns of the 200 or so partners we had. The company had an excellent reputation with regards to customer support because I would often chat and joke around with the partners while they wait for their pressing problems to be solved, their questions answered.

They liked that kind of personal/special attention, and as a partner, that kind of thing goes a long way towards opening up opportunities for your channel that were not advertised in the sales pitch. Try it! Before I was even head of partner relations, I was a partner that learned a lot of cool things and got special access to things not even released to the public yet, including MCN data, tools and features that were in closed beta, even special favors from the CEO himself, because I wanted to be just as beneficial to the MCN as they wanted to be for me. Try to think from a business perspective and think from the perspective of an MCN and you'll be more apt to work something out with them.

3: Do you know just how fortunate you are to be earning the revenue that you are currently? I can't begin to estimate how much you're earning exactly but I remember a time when you couldn't monetize your content at all, unless Youtube specifically offered it to you. But trade places with a Youtuber that's getting maybe 200-500 views a month. Where you are right now doesn't look so bad anymore. I start smiling when I see my ad revenue go up by 5 cents to give you an idea of where I came from. Don't take what you've already got for granted.

Now, I've never been in your shoes or anyone with 2.8 million subscribers to their name. I don't know what things are like up there. But from the humble position I'm at now, I can tell you one thing: you'll have more success with or without an MCN if you develop an attitude of mutual benefit - for yourself and the MCN you're thinking of working with. I honestly want to slap the person who's rich and famous with all the influence in the world who's complaining about what he's not getting out of it because of an avaricious mindset.

By the way, imagine if Youtube suddenly made the ad revenue split 90/10 in their favor. You wouldn't even want to make videos for them, would you? The fact you're able to command that kind of split with the MCN that wants to work with you, is in my opinion, actually pretty generous. I've never heard of anyone offering anything more favorable and surviving the first business cycle.

This was a long post but I hope it least gave you some food for thought.

 

[Hirudov]

Hi everyone,

My channel PDK Films has 2.8m subs and is pulling in an avg of 40-50m views a month and 200k subs a month. I'm considering joining an MCN but I am very hesitant. I get a ton of emails from MCNs everyday and I always delete them. I was in an MCN for two months back in 2014, and they took 20% of my revenue without giving me a thing in return, which is why I am very hesitant to join one again.

With that number of subscribers and viewers you don't need singing under any network. In fact you can create your own network and help smaller creators for a percentage of their earnings.
I know some YouTubers who are much bigger than me (I am hardly nearing 10K subs, they are in the hundreds of thousands) and I discussed the topic with them about networks, product placements, sponsorhip etc...
Staying with AdSense is the best and it's much easier to divide by 1 instead to cacluate 90%-95% 90%=10/9 etc. wait 30 more days for paypal transfers etc, etc... It's not worth limiting yourself with networks, contracts, terms and agreements etc..

 

[KatyAdelson]

I have zero experience working with a network...but...

stating that they would be losing money

That somewhat raises a red flag in my little world. It's not a deal-breaker, but it's something to maybe think about in more detail.

I work in a consulting field, and whenever we take on a project that we're going to lose money on, we're instructed by the management to always "do the bare minimum." I would question what he meant by "losing money" by signing you up with the network, and what he wants to take away from the partnership. I'd clarify with him how available the network's staff will be to help you with your channel since the network is going to lose money signing you on board....

At my job, we take on work that we're going to lose money on for 3 main reasons: we made a poor business decision, it's for a repeat client and we want to keep a good business relationship with them, or our reputation is in trouble and we need to take a hit to save it. I'm not sure if those scenarios can be applied to YouTube Networks, but it might help add a different perspective...?

I would also consider calculating how much money 10% of your earnings would be, and possibly see if there's a more direct way you might be able to hire help for your channel outside of a network. ^_^

 

[Sibernethy]

I have zero experience working with a network...but...


That somewhat raises a red flag in my little world. It's not a deal-breaker, but it's something to maybe think about in more detail.

I work in a consulting field, and whenever we take on a project that we're going to lose money on, we're instructed by the management to always "do the bare minimum." I would question what he meant by "losing money" by signing you up with the network, and what he wants to take away from the partnership. I'd clarify with him how available the network's staff will be to help you with your channel since the network is going to lose money signing you on board....

At my job, we take on work that we're going to lose money on for 3 main reasons: we made a poor business decision, it's for a repeat client and we want to keep a good business relationship with them, or our reputation is in trouble and we need to take a hit to save it. I'm not sure if those ideas can be applied to YouTube Networks, but it might help add a different perspective...?

I would also consider calculating how much money 10% of your earnings would be, and possibly see if there's a more direct way you might be able to hire help for your channel outside of a network. ^_^

I think what he meant by "losing money" could be the simple fact that the revenue split being proposed to the MCN from the Youtuber would severely cramp their capacity to serve the Youtuber because it costs money (sometimes a lot of money) to go jump through whatever hoops the MCN needs to jump through in order to deliver on a top notch level, especially if the Youtuber has expensive needs. That's one of the reasons why the MCN I was part of failed, it ran out of funds and we couldn't bring in enough to keep things alive let alone grow, expand, and have the resources to properly serve the partners we had. People make it so fair and favorable to the partners that the MCN itself is gutted.

 

[wolfpackfilms]

As a former head of partner relations in an MCN myself, I have a few comments to make:

1: 90/10 sounds extremely fair, considering what it takes to run an MCN. Don't be the type that won't settle for 99/1 because without some kind of revenue, the MCN will be unable to properly serve your channel because they're not able to gather the funds and resources they need to get the job done. By now, I'd imagine you probably earn more than the company itself does, though that's just a guess.

2: How well do the staff treat you? How well do you treat the staff? They both tend to go together, really. Back when I was head of partner relations in an MCN, I was pretty much the only guy tending to the needs and concerns of the 200 or so partners we had. The company had an excellent reputation with regards to customer support because I would often chat and joke around with the partners while they wait for their pressing problems to be solved, their questions answered.

They liked that kind of personal/special attention, and as a partner, that kind of thing goes a long way towards opening up opportunities for your channel that were not advertised in the sales pitch. Try it! Before I was even head of partner relations, I was a partner that learned a lot of cool things and got special access to things not even released to the public yet, including MCN data, tools and features that were in closed beta, even special favors from the CEO himself, because I wanted to be just as beneficial to the MCN as they wanted to be for me. Try to think from a business perspective and think from the perspective of an MCN and you'll be more apt to work something out with them.

3: Do you know just how fortunate you are to be earning the revenue that you are currently? I can't begin to estimate how much you're earning exactly but I remember a time when you couldn't monetize your content at all, unless Youtube specifically offered it to you. But trade places with a Youtuber that's getting maybe 200-500 views a month. Where you are right now doesn't look so bad anymore. I start smiling when I see my ad revenue go up by 5 cents to give you an idea of where I came from. Don't take what you've already got for granted.

Now, I've never been in your shoes or anyone with 2.8 million subscribers to their name. I don't know what things are like up there. But from the humble position I'm at now, I can tell you one thing: you'll have more success with or without an MCN if you develop an attitude of mutual benefit - for yourself and the MCN you're thinking of working with. I honestly want to slap the person who's rich and famous with all the influence in the world who's complaining about what he's not getting out of it because of an avaricious mindset.

By the way, imagine if Youtube suddenly made the ad revenue split 90/10 in their favor. You wouldn't even want to make videos for them, would you? The fact you're able to command that kind of split with the MCN that wants to work with you, is in my opinion, actually pretty generous. I've never heard of anyone offering anything more favorable and surviving the first business cycle.

This was a long post but I hope it least gave you some food for thought.

Hey bro,

Awesome information, I really appreciate your insight. I hope my original post didn't come off as avaricious - that's not how I am at all. I'm just very cautious and hesitant - mostly due to the fact that I got stuck in a 80/20 contract a few years ago and lost tens of thousands of dollars in return for absolutely nothing. The MCN took my money and I never received any of the promised 'services' in return. My CPMs didn't budge and they never got back to me on simple things like a channel banner design that I had asked for nicely for weeks. That was CDS, which is now, ironically enough, Studio 71. I finally managed to get out of the contract because I was under 18 when I signed it, and no legal guardian or parent co-signed so they dropped it.

So basically it's a sob story of how I signed a 80/20 and lost a lot of money and never received any value out of it. I'm all for a valuable partnership that benefits both my channel and the MCN, and I've worked with a lot of brands in the past and it has been mutually beneficial. I just want to make sure that this is the case with an MCN. So I hope I don't sound avaricious or greedy, I just don't want to get waxed again lol

Paul

 

[wolfpackfilms]

With that number of subscribers and viewers you don't need singing under any network. In fact you can create your own network and help smaller creators for a percentage of their earnings.
I know some YouTubers who are much bigger than me (I am hardly nearing 10K subs, they are in the hundreds of thousands) and I discussed the topic with them about networks, product placements, sponsorhip etc...
Staying with AdSense is the best and it's much easier to divide by 1 instead to cacluate 90%-95% 90%=10/9 etc. wait 30 more days for paypal transfers etc, etc... It's not worth limiting yourself with networks, contracts, terms and agreements etc..

Appreciate the insight. You make some good points, however, I'm not in the position to help other channels unfortunately. I simply don't have the time or expertise. I do see a lot of value in joining an MCN, but I just want to make sure that the value I receive from the MCN is more than I lose from the 90/10

 

[Sibernethy]

Hey bro,

Awesome information, I really appreciate your insight. I hope my original post didn't come off as avaricious - that's not how I am at all. I'm just very cautious and hesitant - mostly due to the fact that I got stuck in a 80/20 contract a few years ago and lost tens of thousands of dollars in return for absolutely nothing. The MCN took my money and I never received any of the promised 'services' in return. My CPMs didn't budge and they never got back to me on simple things like a channel banner design that I had asked for nicely for weeks. That was CDS, which is now, ironically enough, Studio 71. I finally managed to get out of the contract because I was under 18 when I signed it, and no legal guardian or parent co-signed so they dropped it.

So basically it's a sob story of how I signed a 80/20 and lost a lot of money and never received any value out of it. I'm all for a valuable partnership that benefits both my channel and the MCN, and I've worked with a lot of brands in the past and it has been mutually beneficial. I just want to make sure that this is the case with an MCN. So I hope I don't sound avaricious or greedy, I just don't want to get waxed again lol

Paul

Nah, I trust ya bud. I don't think you're that kind of person. I just wanted to call it to your attention because there are people like that which have more money and power than they know how to make wise use of, and consequently don't.

If you want, come and chat with me. I've got some interesting stories and possibly useful info I learned during my adventures as a creator, an MCN staff member, and being both at the same time.

I know what it's like to be swindled like that, by the way. I was scammed out of $300 by a "marketing service" when I ran an Indiegogo campaign one time. I had emptied my savings account to pay for that, and it hurt like an embarrassing carbuncle.